Transmission

Re: Clunk Engaging Gear from Neutral

Rich M — Fri, 03 Aug 2012 22:00:12 GMT

deflepps:

Thanks Rich, I took my car to Mazda and they thought it could be clutch drag as you mention but haven't really come across it. They did however put my car up and test it - when the car made the noise the rear wheels would turn slightly, is this the clutch drag you referred to? What was interesting is they put a brand new MX up to compare and it did the same but to a smaller degree and maybe not as frequently which backs up your theory that it can exist on a new clutch. Mazda said it is unlikely to get worse and may have been existing from new, to save money they suggested maybe leaving it until or if it gets worse. Do you agree?

Your thoughts would be much appreciated

Thanks in advance

Ben

Hi Ben,

Yes, that's clutch drag.

I'd return the car to Mazda, remind them about the diagnosis session and ask if they would,

1) bleed the clutch for you and 2) adjust out any excess free play in the clutch master cylinder pushrod (there is a 12mm nut on the clevis at the pedal).

That should not be expensive and if the brake fluid change is due (not been changed for a year or two) you might want them to do it as well as it is the same fluid and reservoir for clutch and brakes.

The clutch disengagement point of MX5 is very low near the floor and any air in the hydraulics or slack in the pushrod will lessen the amount of movement available to give clutch clearance when the lever is pressed down.

Clutch release point will usually get higher, giving more clearance, as the clutch wears and if it works well otherwise I'd agree with them and live with it a while and see if it gets better. Sometimes too it can help, when selecting 1st from stationary, to move the stick back towards 2nd first, not all the way into 2nd, just out of neutral towards it, then into 1st. This has the action of using 2nd synchro to stop the main shaft and so 1st usually then slots straight in.

Re: Clunk Engaging Gear from Neutral

deflepps — Fri, 03 Aug 2012 14:19:55 GMT

Thanks Rich, I took my car to Mazda and they thought it could be clutch drag as you mention but haven't really come across it. They did however put my car up and test it - when the car made the noise the rear wheels would turn slightly, is this the clutch drag you referred to? What was interesting is they put a brand new MX up to compare and it did the same but to a smaller degree and maybe not as frequently which backs up your theory that it can exist on a new clutch. Mazda said it is unlikely to get worse and may have been existing from new, to save money they suggested maybe leaving it until or if it gets worse. Do you agree?

Your thoughts would be much appreciated

Thanks in advance

Ben

Re: Clunk Engaging Gear from Neutral

Rich M — Fri, 22 Jun 2012 18:54:28 GMT

Hi, not really, you can have clutch drag with a brand new clutch or you can have it with a totally knackered one for any of my previous reasons. Cost could be anything from £40 to bleed it (if that's all it is) to £400+ for a new clutch so ask them to take a look and take it from there. Perhaps start at the dealer first for what should be a reliable diagnosis.

Re: Clunk Engaging Gear from Neutral

deflepps — Fri, 22 Jun 2012 18:28:58 GMT

Thanks, again sorry guys - how much will this cost to rectify worst case scenario?

Clutch drag sounds a little premature on a car that has done 41k? I guess this may relate to the former drivers.

Re: Clunk Engaging Gear from Neutral

Rich M — Fri, 22 Jun 2012 15:54:48 GMT

Hi, this is clutch drag. The first part of the gear lever movement engages the synchro which allows the gear to be selected on further movement but, because drive is being transmitted via the dragging clutch, you get the clunk as it engages. If the clutch wasn't dragging (the gearbox first motion shaft was stationary) you would get no clunk with that first movement of the gearlever. If the noise was due to slack in a uj or diff joint further back of the gearbox you would get no clunk on engagement but may get the clunk on releasing the clutch and taking up drive.

It could be for several reasons. First check how low the action is from the floor. If it is very low it may simply be the system has air in and needs bleeding or there may be another hydraulic fault such as master, slave, or pushrod adjustment. There are other causes though such as a tight spigot bearing, tight clutch plate splines or a clutch cover that's not lifting correctly. A hydraulic problem is by far the easiest and cheapest problem so do be sure this is investigated properly before letting anyone suggest (much) more expensive cures.

Re: Clunk Engaging Gear from Neutral

deflepps — Fri, 22 Jun 2012 14:02:25 GMT

Thanks do you know how much we are talking as a rough estimate and what needs to be replaced/adjusted?

Re: Clunk Engaging Gear from Neutral

victormeldrew — Fri, 22 Jun 2012 13:33:47 GMT

deflepps:
Does this sound familiar to anyone?

Yes...it sounds rather like it did the first time you described it. There should not be any drivetrain shunt when engaging a gear with the clutch depressed...it means that drive is getting past the clutch when it is depressed, which is what happens when a clutch is not disengaging properly, i.e. is dragging.

However, I would also say that it is hardly the end of the world so, if you can live with it, save your cash until it gets worse.

Re: Clunk Engaging Gear from Neutral

deflepps — Fri, 22 Jun 2012 11:19:13 GMT

Hi Guys, just a quick update, I have narrowed the noise down to the following:

1) I fully disengage the clutch, then

2) Push the clutch completely down , then

3) Move gearstick towards first and literally just before I engage first gear there is a clunk. Following this the gear will engage as normal.

Does this sound familiar to anyone? I am having this expertly reviewed this weekend but would be nice to have any further ideas so I don't get sold down the incorrect route.

Thanks in advance

Re: Clunk Engaging Gear from Neutral

deflepps — Sun, 17 Jun 2012 09:56:44 GMT

Great - appreciate the offer!! I will have the car looked at this week to see if there is a specific reason to what I am hearing (perhaps I am being paranoid a little).

I head you way fairly often so for you to provide me with some expert suggestions/opinions would be much appreciated

Propbably going to try the MX repairers/servicers in Sulston Hills if needed, as you say the reviews look pretty good.

Just to confirm I have a MK3 2006 1.8, mileage at 41,000. Does this help you at all?

Re: Clunk Engaging Gear from Neutral

woodsie — Sat, 16 Jun 2012 21:33:26 GMT

Don't know what year or mileage your MX is/has done.Could be the clutch pedal needs adjusting/you need a longer left leg!!!!,or it's a rear brake pad sticking---quite common if you've had the handbrake on,but could also be the case if the foot brake has been on.

If you want to compare drives give me a ring on 07973633281 and meet up here or half way.

Haven't tried them myself yet but Sulston Hills(indy MX repairers/servicers) at Wing seem to be getting some good reports from peeps here.

MK3 2005 2.0i sport 58k miles approx

Re: Clunk Engaging Gear from Neutral

deflepps — Sat, 16 Jun 2012 18:13:49 GMT

Thank you all, I will have this properly diagnosed and let you know, if you wish.

Re: Clunk Engaging Gear from Neutral

victormeldrew — Sat, 16 Jun 2012 18:09:56 GMT

deflepps:
Thanks, I just spoke to my father and he confirmed something similar. Again apologies for my lack of knowledge but the dragging clutch relates to the slave cylinder right? Also just to confirm perhaps "clunk" is a too strong word, it may be better to describe as light knock.

We can't diagnose your car's problem for certain over the internet with a description of a noise. What we can do is give you our best guess at the most likely cause of it, and either suggest an approach to diagnose it yourself, or some idea of what a mechanic is likely to tell you if you will get a garage to sort it.

The very first thing I would do, in my 15 years experience of keeping cars on the road myself doing my own work, is to have a look at the slave cylinder to see if it is leaking. If you (as it sounds) are not likely to do such work yourself, then you may as well just go to a garage and ask them what the noise is...and most mechanics would diagnose it in the same way.

Edit: Just to be dibbly doubly clear - this is not a normal noise and there isn't a straightforward explanation for it. Something is wrong.

Re: Clunk Engaging Gear from Neutral

lrjohn — Sat, 16 Jun 2012 18:01:56 GMT

It's caused by the cover plate not releasing enough. can be slave or master adjustment, it's not usually a failing master but can be. It can also be a build up of friction plate dust on the splines of the input shaft to the gearbox.

Re: Clunk Engaging Gear from Neutral

deflepps — Sat, 16 Jun 2012 17:25:49 GMT

Thanks, I just spoke to my father and he confirmed something similar. Again apologies for my lack of knowledge but the dragging clutch relates to the slave cylinder right? Also just to confirm perhaps "clunk" is a too strong word, it may be better to describe as light knock.

Cheers

Re: Clunk Engaging Gear from Neutral

lrjohn — Sat, 16 Jun 2012 16:59:31 GMT

It won't be the diff engaging! You need to have unequal wheel speeds for that and LSDs don't usually engage with a clunk, locking diffs do though and you have not got one of those. The noise you are hearing is drive line slack being taken up due to a dragging clutch.

Davebrg posted earlier this week about a specialist around your neck of the woods, try searching his posts, as I live in kent I didn't pay much attention I am afraid.