MX-5 OC Forum

Dear All,

I am a former MX5 owner and MX5OC member (used to own an immaculate Mk1 R-Type Limited with BBS alloys and in metallic Blue and red leather) and now looking at returning to the MX-5 but this time for track day use.

I have never owned a track day car so not sure what I should be looking for.

Any advice would be greatly welcome.

1. Build or Buy ?

First question I guess is should I buy a car that has already been track prep'd or is it better and cheaper to buy a decent base car and do it yourself ?

For example, how do you know the quality of what you are getting with a car that has already been prep'd and tracked ?

2. Build options ?

If I go down the build route, and assuming I can source a fairly cheap and decent Mk1, can someone give me an idea of the mods I should be looking at doing and the approximate cost of each one. I guess the mods could be done in phases as money allows and track experience grows. If so, can you suggest appropriate mods by phase.

For example, what I was thinking would be:

Phase 1

- roll cage - £100-£200. ABC roll cage is a good one
- racing seats - £50-£150. Cora XYZ are good

Phase 2

- Replace bushes with poly bushes - £100. XYZ are good

etc etc

Also, are there any specific Mk1 models that make for a better foundation as a track day car. For example my previous car had an LSD

3. On the Day

Is there anything I should knwo with regard to equipment and/or costs for the actual track day. For example,

- where can I get insurance from and what should I be budgetting ?
- are there any basic spares or equipment you should have with you on the day so as to avoid any common showstoppers ?

Thanks in advance for your help.

Spy:

1. Build or Buy ?

First question I guess is should I buy a car that has already been track prep'd or is it better and cheaper to buy a decent base car and do it yourself ?

For example, how do you know the quality of what you are getting with a car that has already been prep'd and tracked ?

How good are you with your hands? Why not buy and build...lots of cars out there for sale with various mod states, the problem is some are good (ie work) and some are very, very bad!

My personal advice would be take someone with you that has an interest in tracking cars and preferably someone who knows something about MX5s!

If you're buying a track-dog it really doesn't matter what the bodywork looks like, that's easily rectified with a car that has so many bolt-on panels. It's the mechanics that matter, particularly if they fail half way round a corner!

Spy:

2. Build options ?

Spy:

Phase 1

- roll cage - £100-£200. ABC roll cage is a good one
- racing seats - £50-£150. Cora XYZ are good

Phase 2

- Replace bushes with poly bushes - £100. XYZ are good

Have you found a secret cheap MX5 2nd hand parts outlet? I fear you're about to get a shock when you price these mods up. And don't forget a 4-wheel laser alignment, far more value for money than any add on.

Spy:

3. On the Day

Is there anything I should knwo with regard to equipment and/or costs for the actual track day. For example,

- where can I get insurance from and what should I be budgetting ?
- are there any basic spares or equipment you should have with you on the day so as to avoid any common showstoppers ?

All you need is some flat, good fitting shoes or trainers and a helmet, full face or open it doesn't matter, as long as its in decent nick with no dents or scrapes.

Insurance; you can get specific track day insurance, generally 10% of the value of the car, or some companies (REIS as an example) will offer 4 x track days insurance for no extra fee on top of your policy. In all fairness most don't bother as the track is probably a safer environment to drive your car than most of Britains roads today.

Chances are, attend a day with any of us (or go to a Mazda on Track day) and everyone will help you (and generally everone turns up with far more tools than a Formula 1 team so you'll never struggle for a 6mm allen key   )

PS, welcome to the Club and I'm the Motorsport Coordinator for us so please feel free to PM me, if I don't know the answer I'll know someone that does...

peleton72:

 

Spy:

2. Build options ?

Phase 1

- roll cage - £100-£200. ABC roll cage is a good one
- racing seats - £50-£150. Cora XYZ are good

Phase 2

- Replace bushes with poly bushes - £100. XYZ are good

Have you found a secret cheap MX5 2nd hand parts outlet? I fear you're about to get a shock when you price these mods up. And don't forget a 4-wheel laser alignment, far more value for money than any add on.

 

Thanks for the initial advice

No, I haven't found a cheap parts outlet

The prices I listed were just numbers, not indicative of costs

Saying that, and one of the reasons for asking for a list of mods and prices, is to be able to price up the costs I would be looking at. Hopefully they won't scare me away !

peleton72:

PS, welcome to the Club and I'm the Motorsport Coordinator for us so please feel free to PM me, if I don't know the answer I'll know someone that does...

Thanks for the offer

My initial questions are all listed above, mainly around what mods are needed and indicative costs.

If possible, it would be great if you could point people in the direction of this thread.

If I can get all the answers in one place, it would be easier for me to reference and also, hopefully, provide a useful reference point for other people like me, thinking of getting into MX5 Track Days, in the future.

Thanks.

 ok welcome !

For clarity are you going to drive the car on the road 2 and from the circuit? Or do you have a trailer and tow car ? The difference is the need to keep the car moted and insured for the road also can you do the work yourself ? its probably a great car to start on if your not expearienced.

For occaisional use I would suggest the following:

older car dont worry about the body and interior its all about the mechanics and more specifically the engine and box , I would avoid the LWSC engine ( look up on site ) as it is an inherant weakness and post 94 uk 1.6 cars as they have less power.

complete service for the car all fluids use good quality synthetic oil and gear oils dont forget the diff . Check when was cambelt waterpump done and if not done do it ! Long reach plugs and good leads ( magnecour ). check cooling system carefully while rad is empty look for any scale blocking the upright tubes if so replace rad. consider replacing all coolant hoses and clips if they are old and either cracked or going hard you could remove the heater to save weight and just bypass the 2 hoses at the bulkhead, check the fan works! Budget £300-£400

Then spend on brakes upgraded discs pads and goodrich hose all round min pad material ebc yellowstuff replace brake fluid with a higher spec fluid. budget £250

Suspension probably the area of most contention and possible to spend a huge amount of money std is ok at first but budget £1000 for decent coilovers, bushes and alignment Gaz gold look to be good but mine is still std at the moment son has a cheap ebay rokkor setup and for £180 its very good . IL motorsport chassis braces good for £100 outlay

dont be tempted to fit huge wheels unsprung weight is the key so std daisy or eunos wheels are good 15 inch max diameter good tyres toyo or yokos . budget £250

interior strip it all out get a good sh race seat ( out of date for racing is fine just maqke sure it fits your bum!) and a set of belts (new) Budget £200 per side. remember to sell off all trim to pay for the expensive bits!

 roll bar if you want one go for a TR lane bar budget £400

To start I would just do the service and brakes and strip any trim and get out there and enjoy!

Thanks for the useful advice so far guys, exactly what I am looking for.

I will probably do some of the more basic work myself eg change brake pads, oil etc but for other work I will use a mechanic friend. Will cost a bit more but not much as he will do the work cheaply at home.

I have already assumed that I can get a cheap car where the bodywork (as long as there is no rust) and interior is tatty but has been looked after mechanically. Is the LWSC engine only on teh 1.6 variants ?

Not sure if I need the car roadworthy. I don't have a trailer and don't really have the space therefore my assumption is that the car will need to be taxed and MOT'd so as to drive to the track and back. Not sure if this is wise as I am worried about being stranded at a track if something fails. What is people's experience of this ?

I would have thought that a roll bar is essential, for safety reasons in case the car is rolled - from the post above it looks like this may not be an issue ?

Going back to the first reply regarding insurance, although tracks are safer I would have thought you would at least need third party cover just in case the worse happens and you hit another car injuring the driver.

Finally, I forgot to mention that I am considering running this project with a my cousin who is also a petrol head. The plan is that we split all costs 50/50 and go to track days together, sharing the track time between driving and being a passenger. Has anyone done this before and is it a good idea or am I missing some potential pitfalls ?

Thanks again for the help and advice.

 No requirement for any insurance on track and as for 3rd party cover I have never heard of that ! You can get track day cover that covers your car but the excess is fairly hefty so its not really applicable to an older MX5.

LWSC is a 1.6 issue only if you have a 1.8 it does not have the same issue.

the trailer vs drive question is a biggy a good trailer is £1200 + plus a suitable tow car and then you need to be an old git who passed before 1997 to legally tow it without another test. Lots do drive to and from the circuit you just need to consider having a service barge with tools and wheels and tyres etc as not much fits in a 5 with a passenger too make sure your insurance co know about mods too or you could have a problem.

being stranded at the circuit is a risk but if a second car is there you can at least get home and most circuits have somewhere you can park a dead or damaged car for a few days while you get sorted and the AA rac have also recovered several from brands in the last year or so  so maybe thats an option.

I got an Eunos really just for track & fun weekend driving. Here is my 2 pence worth if getting the car for road and track, without stripping it out.

I have read loads of threads on all major improvements/safety features such as brakes, roll bars, suspension, 4 wheel alignment, helmet etc and this is what i found:

Brakes - get some super repsonse 4.1 fluid, discs must be at least vented on the front (I'm not even sure if you can get the front discs without vents), and then get some decent pads like RedStuff or YellowStuff (about £100). Then if you want to spend a bit more get grooved/dimpled discs like Tarox, EBC, Red Dot (there are loads!) and braided lines, then upwards like multi-pot big brake kits.

Roll Bar - Not needed really. Judging by peoples responses there is very little chance of rolling a car as long as it sits low, i.e. you'd have to slide off and hit a large divit side on and be very unlucky. There is lots of stuff online about roll bars not doing much though as they are not high enough etc. Full roll cage is the way to go if you want full protection. But get one if it think you'll need it. I'm getting one just for piece of mind.

Helmet - Again general response is "this is the most important part of your body" so protect it as much as you can. V2 Pro helmets are snell 2005 approved and seem cheap for the price. A mate has one and they look great. Otherwise its looking £300 upwards. Or just hire them at the events for £10 a day.

Suspension - As a minimum upgrade the springs and shocks. usually some on ebay like Bilstiens. Fully Adjustable coilovers are the way forward when your budget allows, you might even get lucky and find these cheap.

4 Wheel Alignment - Get it done. Type in 'Hunter 4 wheel alignment' into google. That is apparently the best piece of kit available at the mo to get it done on. Plus an experienced mechanic and your onto a winner. Wheels in Motion have a good rep on this forum.

Tyres - I'm using what came on my car at the mo P6000, and they suck, but they will do until I shred them. Cheaper tyres like Toyo T1R or Kumho KU31 are good, up to Toyo R888 I think they are called, which at the other end of the scale.

Other bits - If you want to increase air flow get an air induction kit. If increasing air intake then you may as well increase exhaust outlet - Get a 4-2-1 branch manifold (then plus various heat reducing parts like exhaust wrap etc), de-cat and a nice stainless steel exhaust. It'll give you a little bit more power and will sound awesome! Then there is silicone pipes, air vents and ducting, and making everything lighter like aluminum radiators.Then your onto engine mods = empty your wallet. I have found any product with a 'motorsport' label has what I've call motorsport tax = very very expensive.

and if you are not getting a harness get a cg lock. And maybe get a small fire extinguisher.

Hopefully that makes sense. The more you can do yourself the cheaper it will be. And it will also be cheaper to get a car with some of it already done. Mods, useless loads and loads of them, doesn't seem to add value onto the car so you'll need to take them all off again when you sell it. If you want a car just for racing you might want to check mad5a racing and max5 racing sites and look at cars for sale.

There is huge amounts that can be added to the above, but that is my basics. As a guide including buying the car i've done the basic suspension upgrade, discs and pads, then air intake and full exhaust. Alignement needs doing again. Plus all service items like changing spark plugs, oil, filter etc, then changing bits that needed placing like headlights, heater pipes, nuts, bolts etc I think i'm at around £1800. unfortunately for me a recent head gasket repair has sent this cost skywards.

quick edit - I purchased the car with the air intake and manifold on already. I added the Cat back exhaust (+ new CAT) and exhaust wrap

Thanks for a very comprehensive write-up of your own experience. Really, really helpful.

How are you enjoying using it ?

Also, how much is it costing to fix the head gasket ?

 Just watch out for exhaust wrap ! I regularly put out fires on track due to this as it does 2 things well , it absorbs any leaking oil and gets very hot , think Im up to 6 so far this year , I would use cerachrome type coatings instead , I even made my son promise he would never use a wrap on his cars !

mad4amanda:

 Just watch out for exhaust wrap ! I regularly put out fires on track due to this as it does 2 things well , it absorbs any leaking oil and gets very hot , think Im up to 6 so far this year , I would use cerachrome type coatings instead , I even made my son promise he would never use a wrap on his cars !

Exhaust wrap ?

Aren't they stainless steel ?

 I've just built my own and costs have spirralled !!

Some rough costs -

Two brake calipers were seized (one front, one back) replaced all the calipers,pads,discs, hoses -about 500 quid.

Roll bar - 300 quid.

Tyres(second hand) 150 quid.

Engine/GBox/Diff oil/Brake fluid/clutch fluid - about 150 quid.

Plugs/Leads/Gaskets/Hoses/Misc items- 200 quid.

Misc items (paint/grease/wet n dry/wire brush/cleaning material/lubrication,etc,etc,etc) god knows but probably 300 quid easily - amazing how all the little items add up !!

Extras cos mine was turbo'd -

Repair BBR Exhuast manifold - 300 quid.

Turbo rebuild - 300 quid.

I'm EASY up to 2.5K and still shocks/springs to go/alignment - haven't even made it to the track yet !!

Don't under estimate it it really mouts up- obviously is up to you how far you go with it all.

Oh forgot - Sparco seat 75 quid - harness 50 quid !!

Spy:

Thanks for a very comprehensive write-up of your own experience. Really, really helpful.

 

How are you enjoying using it ?

 

Also, how much is it costing to fix the head gasket ?

It's great. I'm really enjoying all of it TBH like doing all the mods, changing to odd bit here and there (don't get me wrong some of these issues are also really really annoying and expensive!), hammering it at the weekends, then the fun of the track days. I haven't done a lot of them so its still quite a nervous experience at first but great! Doing it with my mate (track days and mods that is) is also a great social part of it. The amount of time spent on MX5 forums now is getting silly though.

Just be aware that budgets can rocket if your not careful! Its the small things that add up the costs, like I now have to buy new alignment bolts, get a new rear caliper, rad cap and some other smaller bits. Finding a cheap MX5 in great mechanical condition with no/not a lot of rust is the first issue. You would pick up a better bargain if you were buying over the winter period but you may be lucky.

Head gasket, water pump and timing belt cost £720, and that was at a garage where a relative works so I got a discount. I had some insane quotes going up to £1600.

On the exhaust wrap issue - I'll keep a very very close eye on it from now on and check for oil leaks constantly. I went for the DEI Titanium Exhaust Wrap as it had the highest heat rating I could find. They are fabric wraps, you can get heat sheilds which can be stainless steel. I've got one of those aswell but being steel it does heat up still. There are blanket type wrap things available, but they were too expensive for me